Brian Doyle: Overcoming Addiction and Rejection

welcome everybody to another episode of rebuilding life after addiction and I'm excited for today's interview as I am about every interview because it's an opportunity to spread hope and spread stories of encouragement and I really enjoy diving in with some of our guests and it's not too often I get the opportunity to connect with somebody that I've known for it's got to be 20 years now I've known Brian probably longer than that and his family and I was chatting about getting people on the podcast and Brian put his hand up and said he'd be willing to come in chat and so Brian Doyle I'm excited to welcome you to rebuilding life after addiction man how are you doing today I'm doing fantastic today this is I wouldn't say it was a dream come true but it's something that I've really wanted to get back into because you'll know a little bit more about me later but I've been walking with the Lord and in recovery for probably as long as you're been alive Justin and every once in a while it's like what it would be nice to get back into that those are my people church people are church people and those in recovery are yes we're family but man we're different so this is exciting yeah so it is interesting I mentioned and we were talking a little bit before I hit the record button about some history and 20 plus years ago I think we knew each other when I was still in my mess right and my parents were trying to help me get my life together you guys some other folks at the church back then were trying to help and Brian I don't think I realiz way back then that you had a recovery story and it's and maybe it probably came up back then but my memories from that time are very scattered and so I'd love to hear this is an addiction podcast recovery people are your people well can you bring us into that a little bit give us some context on that yeah I'm not going to spend a lot of time in my War Stories because we all have them but from my early teens into into my 20s I was an alcoholic I was a drug addict I was a garbage head pot and alcohol were my big things and the addiction hit like a freight train the very first time I drank outside the home I was escorted home by the cops so it was not okay from day one dropped out of high school in my senior year was I was smart enough I guess or I took tests well enough that I still got into the Navy after dropping out of high school without a high school diploma spent 18 months in the Navy before they tossed me out because of my drinking then from that point I went into three other rehabs two more halfway houses and a week after my 21st birthday so April 27th of 1991 I went into my last rehab and that's that's the last time I drank so my history is not bars it's not hanging it's it's none of that because I couldn't handle drinking legally my last real story I guess would be I walked into a bar one night I think it was a Thursday night maybe and the next thing I remember I was being woken up by my employees in front of the store I used to been manag dressed shirt tie on shirt on just passed out in my car and that's that was scary but that was the life I lived for six eight 10 years so that's my condensed version we all have those special pieces but I got arrested right before I went into to the rehab the last time for as a contributing charge bought some kids some alcohol and but what happened was they turned that instead of a contributing charge they turned it into an unlawfully dealing with a minor charge and that just sounds ugly that's that's not okay that doesn't sound good now that sounds really bad yeah so and of course I was arrested there on my front porch my mom behind me parents of the kids across the street in a small Tiny Town so everybody knew by the afternoon what was going on and that was my breaking point that was not only an embarrassing to myself and knowing that this was not okay but man I shamed my family in front of the entire town so that was that's what got me through the door the first time and that's when I got serious I found along the way that not only drugs and alcohol were a drug of choice but women were a drug of choice as well and I made the commit commment in my in that last rehab that the 30 days I was in it I wouldn't talk to a female and man that was almost harder than quitting drinking and that but that's what would need to happen and that's took from there it was I was serious that time and to that point you were serious that time right that's I want to dive into that a little bit more because I think it always it always intrigues me to have conversations with people and that have gone through multiple rehab attempts and then when that last one finally seems to take right it's like I've always tried to dive into that and figure out what was different what was it and you talked about some of the charges and some of that stuff being a wakeup call but what was going on in your heart it in your mind if you remember during that season that made this time different be being an addict I think we are so selfish and self-centered and all we need is what we need next or what we want is what we need next and I think this time around again I grew up in a town my graduating class was 65 people and there was maybe 3,000 people in my town Upstate New York so everyone knew everybody and this time around it was public it wasn't my private shame it wasn't anything private it was out in the open my parents got involved it was just it was serious it was real that time it wasn't yeah I get arrested as a minor and where I get all of that stuff it's it this was serious this was an embarrassing charge on top of it and a sh it was shame it was I was okay with like a private shame but to get my shame out in the open like that and everybody sees it that's what broke me this time it was real that private shame we can mean we can hide right we can avoid it nobody else knows what's going on it's just me and it's just my Demons yeah man that's that's profound I think you hear stories like that and then you see stuff in scripture like matth 18 right where it talks about dealing with sins and one and then a group and then bring it in front of the church it's like the Lord understands he of course he understands what it takes at times to get us to go to that place of this is where you're going to repent and ultimately change your life right is and for more stubborn of us some of sometimes it a one-onone conversation with a brother just doesn't get it right it's like the last straws in front of the church and it's like why would the Lord say that well it's not because he wants to embarrass us because we're just thickheaded at times exactly and not only are we thickheaded I think is we are as a community of those addicts and in recovery we're so used to our shame we're and it's okay and like you said we can deal with it we can hide it and we can oh we could try to hide it we can try to deal with it but it's it's it's ours and you bring it out in front of the church or bring it out in front of like on my front porch it's not private anymore it's public and it's it's there's there's there was a shift from shame to it was desperation it's like what am I doing to myself I had a death wish I had a vow that I wasn't going to live past 23 wasn't spoken much of but every once in a while it's like man I'm not going to live past 23 why am I even going to worry about it and the lord caught me at 21 so I have a feeling that was not far in coming my death and it was one of those things it's the shame like I said the private shame to the public shame and guilt and con conviction I think was profound like you said it was just it changed my life at that point it was almost a Deliverance because there wasn't many days after that there was a desire to use again it was that profound so let me ask you about what you just said with that the private Death Wish right and depression and suicide man is a huge issue and 20 2023 and man like some may not say that I'm suicidal or acknowledge it that way but you bring up an interesting spin on that where that suicidal thoughts or that Death Wish if you will is coming is happening internally but we're doing something now we're drinking ourselves into death or using drugs and it's not spoken about and so I'm curious did that exist prior to the decision to start drinking and the cycle of rehab was that related to something else or was it a fruit of the lifestyle I think it was a fruit yeah I think it was a fruit be because once I got probably out of the second rehab the big book says we're we're it's going to be we're going to be hospitalized institutionalized or death or in prison and I was convinced that's I there wasn't there was no helping me I was convinced that I was either going to be in a hospital me being the size I am I wasn't going to last prison very long so I knew that was not an option for me or I was going to die the closer I got to my recovery the more institutionalized I was convinced I was going to be but there was still that underlying I don't care what I don't care what I take I'm going to do you want to give me something I'll take it I was that garbage head you want me to try it I'll try it you want me to do it 12 times I'll do it 12 times today sure I try anything once I'll try it two or three times I don't even care and that was the attitude it was I don't care what this does to me and if I die because of it but I again it wasn't a conscious I'll die if I die it was just I'll try it and if it doesn't work out yeah so let's let's talk about the decision in rehab you're there right you're you said it was almost like a Deliverance so on and we're talking about the sobriety piece of it right but how about the salvation piece right where did you find God in this whole journey had you been playing with God beforehand and knew about him or were you just an unbeliever and how did you become introduced to Jesus I was Catholic I grew up Catholic I was an altar boy that was one of my first tastes of really good wine was as an alter boy because they do have some serious wine there but so I knew the Catholic side of God but that was really about it I was sober for about a year replacing my addictions with women again because that so I was chasing a girl she was in the rooms we went to a a motorcycle group actually a motorcycle Ministry there was about six or eight of them there that just L Jesus and was hanging out and drinking coffee and they were my guys well they were little extreme for me motorcycle wise because two or three of them came out of some serious gangs but she invited me so I was like sure I'm going to hang out with her I'll go and they preached on the Church of laa in Revelation that's where they were in their Bible study and I got I'm one of the few I think that got saved out of Revelation it was and it wasn't a I'm afraid of it was a this is the unadulterated truth I've been looking for because that's the word of God is truth and it's it when your heart is ready when my heart was ready it didn't matter where he was teaching out of it was truth and it just it broke me and I said the little prayer that night that Thursday evening in a motorcycle garage in Upstate New York and I haven't looked back since that was 92 so April of 92 was it was right around my anniversary time and so April of 992 I got saved I was sold out the biggest thing I think for me was that group of men in as a motorcycle group the guy who prayed with me became my best man in my wedding three of them played music at my wedding that they were my people that was my tribe if you would and I still stayed in the rooms for a little while maybe another 6 Months 8 months 10 months but eventually it got into I was hanging out with these guys seven days a week sleeping at their house just being mentored by them discipled by them being loved by them and that is that's my recovery is community and Men men in particular we need each other to be vulnerable to be safe with each other to say what I'm really I'm today sucks and not oh bless God you got to do this and do just like all right today sucks that's fine let's hang out and have a cup of coffee and get through it that is that's that's being a disciple that's being a mentor that's being family yeah it's so good we talked I was talking to somebody about that after church yesterday on they walked up to me and said how you doing and I was like ah good and then I paused and I looked at him no that's a lie yeah I'm tired like and she responded she looked at me and she's like yeah I've started responding authentically to people I just don't say good anymore she's like I was in a gas station after my a had died and I the person asked me how I was doing and I'm like I'm a wreck right now and I said I appreciate that Honesty so let's let's talk about we hear a lot of like salvation stories right where the recovery comes at the altar as a response to the gospel message right and that often times kickstarts the journey to recovery and people find their freedom in that route well you had begun the journey to recovery first and then you found your way to Jesus and so I'd love to unpack that a little bit right because you said you were still dealing with some issues of chasing women and whatnot not the alcohol anymore more but what changed what was different on the recovery Journey after you found Christ right how did that shift for you did it shift your perspective on it or the effectiveness yeah I think the effectiveness I think once for me for my story once I found Christ not as the higher power as I understood him but as the higher power that our savior our Lord our King our creator AA in the rooms became a little less effective because they were all chasing sobriety yes there was good steps and yes there's a spiritual awakening and it's a spiritual program but at the point of my salvation I found I had that Spiritual Awakening to not like I said a higher power but to God to the god the one and only the rooms became a place of evangelism for me I got my food through church and my fellowship and my and the men I hung out with and a lot of them were in recovery as well so we were able to talk about the deeper issues the depression the abandonment the rejection all of that why because alcoholism and drug addiction is just a symptom of something else that's that's there's deeper issues that we need to deal with in order to stay sober without Christ so that it became the fields were white and they were in AA for me and it was a time of learning of outside of the time with my tribe it was a time of isolation because I there was again a small town all my friends were users they were all still active so it was me I picked up a Guitar and I read my Bible probably 18 hours a day for a year and a half and that's all I had outside of my fellowship of the guys but again it just became ineffective because again I it was the rather than chasing sobriety I wanted to know the truth I wanted to know him and so in that journey of community right and digging into the word you mentioned something extremely important there the alcoholism the drug use is a symptom right what did so what did the Lord start to reveal to you about your history right and why this journey began on what did you dive into in the word the brothers exposing you because I know they do that right are good our accountability man they call out our blind spots and our junk and I love that about good relationships but what started to come to the surface for you as you started to unpack why did I end up here like I'm grateful that life is changing but we're all curious as to why and what did the Lord reveal to you I came from broken family and I think most everybody present company excluded can relate to a broken family my parents were divorced early in my life there was a couple things in that season I'm still dealing with I go to counseling once a week and I'm trying to get down deep into some of the real ugly nasty deep issues but on the surface it's rejection and abandonment there was a a perfectionism that was happening in my family we have to look the part of the good family my when my dad left he he cursed himself for crying when he was saying goodbye to me so to a eight-year-old 10-year-old what does that means men don't cry so you need to figure out a different way to deal with that and alcohol is a fantastic way to deal with that one and those types of things there was a lot of stuff I was an awkward shy kid from as early as I can remember I probably have said more in this 20 minutes we've talked than I did in a week's worth of conversation when I was around that age so I was just awkward so how do you get all over awkward well you put on a facade you go give yourself some chemicals to get over that awkwardness lots of rejection family not only family but in school and friends and non-friends and schoolmates and all of that it was just it was a very isolated experience I've had and that was trying the cliche trying to fit in and any crowd will do if you're if they accept you that's what happened with me yes so feelings of rejection are a lot more common I think than most people realize like especially for men we like to deny that because we don't want to we don't want to put off the air that we're weak and yeah inwardly I think we all struggle with some rejection from time to time what does the Lord spoke to you specifically on that like how have you battled that feeling of rejection over the course of your lifetime yeah rejection has probably been the strong stronghold and again the Lord's still working it out in me the most important thing and it's it's very simple when you see it is God has accepted me God loves me God died for me he forgave my sins he's done all these things for me and if he's accepted me it doesn't matter who else accepts me because he's the one that matters and it sounds confrontational when I say it that way but there I think for us as the community and Recovery Christianity is a very we say selfless relationship and Recovery is very selfish I have to do things for myself to stay sober but I think Christianity also is there's a tinge there's a line of selfishness in it I need to know that God loves me and he accepts me and I don't care what anybody else thinks and it doesn't it's not an ugly way but it's it's one of those I need to do that for me it's just like you are saying you were tired but if we continue to work through three four weeks of being tired and not taking care of ourselves how effective are we for the kingdom so I need to be selfish for myself in those in the good ways so I can be effective for somebody else and that's one of the things that he's been laying on me it's it's he has it there was an issue I'll give you a little illustration there was an issue a couple years ago through a my old church where I was going to be ordained as a Foursquare pastor I'm I was licensed but I was going to go through the ordination process and through situations our senior pastors decided not to recommend us for ordination and it was heartbreaking and it was hurt it was that's that's that's an episode all by itself off camera unrecorded but through that the Lord continued to speak to me and said the four square denomination is not ordaining you I am ordaining you are ordained by me and that CHange it was a change of perspective of he has called me he has ordained me he has saved me he has died for me and yes Christianity is a very selfless relationship but at the same time that the old saying Jesus is Jesus loves you but he's my I'm his favorite yeah it's true that's how I feel I'm his favorite between the two of you J Justin I'm his favorite right in my life I disagree but it's okay exactly but that's exactly in your life you're his favorite and that's that's that's that our identity and that's yeah that's that's the selfishness of it I and he's he's jealous I'm jealous of his love I'm jealous of his acceptance of me that's where everything starts for me is I am his child I am his son before I'm his servant I am his son yeah it's interesting with rejection because I think rejection and people pleasing tend to go hand in hand and I know I've struggled with that at some points in my life it's like well if I can you if I leaning to the people please pleasing and just doing and doing then they won't be so quick to reject me and so sometimes we end up running our tank empty trying to really I guess just impact or control people's perception of us so that they accept us and and that's it's a very real struggle especially I think so I know you talked about getting plugged into the biker ministry right the Fields being white and just seeing as you begin to find Christ a threat of purpose right and I know for many folks that I talk to over and over that is like man this is keeping me clean this is this purpose having this driving force you is how the Lord is keeping me clean well on the other end of that you pair that desire to serve that desire to break the selfishness off of our life in a very hard way with a Spirit of Rejection and it can become a recipe for Burnout really fast oh absolutely and burnout and legalism and to-do lists and all of those check checklists and all of that stuff great transition Justin I don't think you get it but you will I've been reading a book I think I mentioned it in my bio I sent yet the book is called The Cure from John Lynch I've read it five times since May and I'm going to continue to read it until I get it and the premise of the book is the scripture without faith it is impossible to please God and the question he brings up is what's the goal is the goal to please God or is the goal to have faith in God and I as a Christian for the 30 years have been taught that we have faith so we can please God but man that's such a slippery slope of pleasing God gets into legalism gets into this don't do this do that read your Bible more do all of these things where that premise of the book is having faith in God trusting God pleases God so the pleasing God is the result of having faith in God and trusting him so it's it's just a an outshoot of our love for him and our faith in him is that I'm pleasing him not the other way around I'm not pleasing him so I can have faith in him so I can get accepted by him but I'm just pleasing him just because I love him and I trust him with everything and he's pleased with that it's the starting at acceptance right versus starting at works and yeah that's really good I have to check that book out and I'll drop for those who are watching I'll drop the link down in the comments in the description so you can find that yeah I grew up when I got saved Brian the pastor at the program I was at Teen Challenge I remember the second half he quoted faith without works is dead over and over again that and that becomes some of my you some of my Mantra because like but I also see the risk in leaning into that verse too much right because in intention the idea is to let my faith be active and you can't have faith without works right Paul's James is absolutely correct there but like sometimes I think the risk on the other side of this addiction thing and being in Ministry is that I think I'm justified by my works at times and I heard somebody say that the biggest risk in Ministry is to have a lousy friendship with Jesus and a and on great working relationship and that's something that I think has has Chang Chas me down over these years as I've been engaged in Ministry since I got sober and got clean myself and and I had do thinking about that rejection piece man like that is I was dealing with some criticism the last couple days and on some external criticism from folks who are just saying things and some of the things they're saying are just categorically nonsense but like that stuff still gets to your heart when you read it and it's like well I just want them to see me correctly and in that those moments it's like well am I more concerned with how they see me or am I concerned with what how what God sees because and still man it's as men I don't think it's one of those things we ever I don't know that I'll ever fully resolve it I don't think so either I think it's one of those things that it is just there and it not only will it a lot of times it will keep us humble because for me I'm I'm I my default is that insecure arrogance and this keeps me humble but also it continues to drive us back to him because everything that he does drives us to him that's his purpose and that is and again back to the trusting and the pleasing I just trust him I trust him with my life I trust him with my reputation I even trust him with my tarnish reputation I trust him with my lack I trust him with my riches I TR I just trust him and the harder it gets the more I can choose to be driven to him or driven away from him and whenever I make the choice to drive to him it's okay it they whatever that is the criticism the rejection the feelings of rejection the feelings of whatever betrayal that just gets less because my focus is on him it's it's it's again it's it's trusting him that I don't Focus so much on man where would I have been if I didn't use for those 10 years or eight years however and I actually graduated high school with the grade point that I started high school with I was got thrown off the tennis team I was a top seed tennis player and getting close to the state level where would I have been man I can't think that way everything drove me to my bride and my kids and where I am in Pennsylvania now and my coordination my call of Pastor and it's just everything brought me here because what good would I be to someone like our friend we spoke to about earlier without at least an idea of what that person's going through let those that will reach that other person let them have that good clean healthy life getting raised I'm called to us because that's who God created me to be is the minister to the broken because that's where he brought me from let's talk about that part of your story for a little bit right we've talked about the struggle and the rehab and that part of the journey but man let's talk about the fruit of the transformed life for a little bit and man I know there's there's a lot right you could talk about over 20 years of 20 plus years how long has it been since rehab but you said 92 32 years so man a lot of fruit in that season right and man hit some of the highlights maybe for the people here like what is God done how you mentioned ordination children wife Pastor there's a lot there man and there's a ton there and I love it's it's I think that before I get into it I think the biggest compliment I can get is when I let people know that I just met that man I was a homeless a drug addict by the time I was 20 years old I was living on the beach in Pensacola after I got thrown out of the Navy and they'll say man you I can't picture that and I'm like man that does my heart good because of the Redemption of Christ yeah I was married to Donna Donna she's she's the love of my life she's my bride we've been married for 27 years I have two stepdaughters that I call my own I walk them both down the aisle be because of God's goodness I have two biological boys that my baby Josh is 25 I don't even can you I don't know if you remember just Joshua but he was probably an INF when you last saw him but he was he's a veteran he got out of the army and he's 25 now and we're together one of the proudest dad moments I think is when he went into the army he was called a unicorn because he was a high school graduate never got arrested his parents were still together and he didn't have tattoos at the time and that's a unicorn that's that's that's something that they don't see anymore the biggest thing we are together and am I going to say that it's all been rainbows and whatever the saying no absolutely not Don and I have gone through some stuff but God has been in the center Jesus is in the center and this coming February be 28 years that's a blessing in this day and age now through my work in progress as a person in recovery yeah I have a hard time with employment I've I've bounced around a lot I don't stick around very often God's working that out in me I've got a job that's fantastic right now I'm I'm I'm still in retail which I'm not in love with but I'm good at and he's blessed me with a nine-to-five retail job with yeah every other weekend off too so you can't go wrong but that those are the blessings the yes I'm I'm ordained now I was ordained in October through for square but I preach now here's a guy that wouldn't was a Wallflower that even at Shannon no Shiloh I was a Wallflower I didn't speak to people then I was uncomfortable in groups am I still very comfortable in groups no but that's what prayer and fasting and depending on a big as big a group it is yeah I will pray and fast a day or two before I have to do something if need be because there's power in the Holy Spirit to get me through that and that's something I've just learned through counseling and that's another blessing Beyond us as a man I will shout to the rooftops that if you have any I would say any past meaning if you're still alive go to counseling yeah we Deep dive deep and sometimes it's hurtful and sometimes it's miserable and it hurts but sometimes it's just a safe place to just talk to somebody and we as men need that the I can continue to talk about but I've got five grandkids my youngest is seven my oldest is gosh is he 19 already that's yeah he's 19 that's not okay I'm getting old I think it's amazing man to hear that because it's like the fruit of the transformed life right and sometimes we get down in the ditch and we help people see their struggle and we identify them with that area but there is that threat of like man like I think you and I would both agree that like if God can do it for us like he can do it for you he can do it for anybody as well and then like I had it hit me the other day man I was on a conversation with my co-host Rob who usually jumps on here with me and and I had talked to somebody and I was struggling because I just didn't see what I had in the moment until somebody that I used to know that I was trying to help out of addiction this was several years back made a comment to me like Pastor Justin do you not see it I'm like do I not see what you're living in the middle of the life we're all dreaming about and like that just because I didn't feel that and so that hit me like a freight train in the moment because here I am complaining about some of my struggles and we all do go through struggles no matter what season of life we're in but then that the Lord again having those moments to give us just reality checks and keep us humble and grateful and I'm like man like I never heard somebody say it so bluntly to me and so directly and it just really hit me that's truth with a capital T because I remember way back in remember the first six months of our recovery and you see someone who's who's been around and he's got a family and he's got grandkids and he's got a job and he's doing Ministry and he's doing this and he's just living life and it's like I'm never going to get that there's no way I'm going to get there all striving to get there but it's like there's no way that's so Out Of Reach to where we are right now and that man that hit me hard J Justin thank you that's that's important to remember that yeah it keeps us humble Keeps Us grateful but then like man I yeah sometimes perspective is a difficult thing to get a hold of and when the Lord gives you those moments to you get a bird's eye you and yesterday man we you and I have been talking and I won't mention names or details but about a mutual friend and somebody we know from a long time ago and I got off that phone yester the other day and it just it was a 10-minute phone call the form was probably filled out in 20 seconds but the Lord showed me the 20 years it took to make that call happen and and like I'm grateful to have the opportunity to help but in a moment I was just telegraphed back to very key moments in my life where different decisions could have led me somewhere else and the Lord just reminds us so often in those moments and man I wanted to talk about that for a little bit because it is unique to have you on the call considering you knew Justin you knew me the third person I'd never have heard myself away that's that's that's terrible to edit that part out I'm just kidding but back when I was a messed up teenager man my parents were attending church with you guys at shanid o Shiloh still trying to figure out whether Teen Challenge or what Teen Challenge was going to become and they had this call to help addicts but their son and their daughters all of us were addicts ourselves and man I do remember some interactions you and I had from way back then and and yeah I just I don't really know what questions I want to ask here like in regard to this side of the story but yeah do you I thought it would just be fun to chat on that for a few minutes I was I've been thinking about it since we've reconnected and I remember I don't know how often we had one-on-one conversations I'm sure we must have had one or two but I remember your mom and dad and I remember the heartache I remember the tough times stimes brother I remember them really asking that question because we would meet with John and devel in their on the dining room table in their kitchen table actually and just going through like the workbooks just just going through it just to go through it with them because Donna and I have always felt that call towards help in the Attic and it's yeah we will partner with you guys and we'll we'll do whatever you want us to do we'll hang out with you and yeah those questions were tough then it's like we are starting this thing and here's our family and I don't think I had any words of wisdom back then other than just keep going because God's called you to do this that's that's the important thing the like for myself I was I've been personally involved in the addiction Donna was a third party of the addiction through her first marriage and abuse that thing but it's it's still part of our story it's still with your mom and dad it's man they can relate to the parent and the loved ones in such a way that a lot of people can't and it's it's yes there's an anointing to do it but there's also that experience of yes God could tell me what you're feeling but man I'm coming from where I felt it and there's just power there so I need to reconnect with John Nela now it's it's starting to stir but yeah I your parents really had a hard time I remember I don't know if you went to our youth group were you part of that once or twice because I remember there was a there was a handful of man we our youth group was a bunch of gangsters me and Jeremy were buddies Jeremy's buddy and I were okay so you were a little bit older than like Adam then you didn't hang out with Adam you were older than he was no I wasn't older I just hung out with Jeremy I just hung out with older people okay all right so yeah so interesting I had been thinking about this man and I remember so I remember when everything fell apart the first time I told you a little bit about this prior to the call but I had gotten some mess and long story short to avoid criminal charges for robbing an apartment above a church because that's the person I was right let me steal from yeah and they ended up pushing me to Teen Challenge and I came to Shen charow a few nights before I was supposed to leave and it was you either go or I was getting charges pressed on me which was the appropriate response I was receiving Grace and I remember being in the service that night you guys were there and my parents had given me a Bible and I remember you it was this was 2003 and the reason I know the date it was I think it was around November I got the date in the inside cover of my Bible still because I believe it was you and Donna that prayed over me that evening and you said something to the effect of stop doing things your way and let God take control and I wrote that on the inside cover of my Bible and it's still there 20 years later man and it's the Bible that I ended up I went to Teen Challenge the first time for four days left went back again but it's the Bible that I took with me and I ended up keeping with me all the way through the program and I still preach up from it pretty regularly it's in pretty rough shape now but a lot less rough shape than I was when I got it so we're grateful for that and and man I think it's I appreciate being able to chat with you today and just hear your journey a little more in detail but Al also man to just say thank you for the moments that you had impact on my journey whether directly or indirectly through my parents because I think sometimes we don't get an opportunity to go back and impact the little PE not the little people but the people that planted Little Seeds along the way and it because it is sometimes a journey God uses some people that maybe in the moment they don't feel like they're breaking through but there are those seeds planted all along the way and you guys were some of those people you undoubtedly were suppor ing my parents in one of their most difficult seasons of life watching all their kids succumb to drug and alcohol addiction and so man just thank you for sharing your story but also what you did so many years ago to make an impact on our life and our family man it's just it's an awesome thing well yeah that's that's humbling we talked about humble a lot today that is humbling that's that's I don't know what to say I'm I'm just humbled I'm I'm humbled that again Another Blessing of from God that God will allow me to be used in such a way or partnered with I don't like be like the phrase used by God much anymore I like to partner with God because we don't God doesn't use people he loves he partners with them which was a huge paradigm shift in my brain and it's it's just that humbling of he spoke through me something that touched you and now look at you look what God has done in your life it's it's humbling it's awesome I that's exciting that's that's rooftop screaming look at my God be really because it's it's a foundation it's it's my oldest son's middle name is Elija because we prayed a double an a double portion upon his life and he's he's beginning to work it out and he's more sold out than I ever was at 26 he's just there and so I see the Legacy beginning in my Generation with myself and Donna building for my family but also someone like yourself being able to jump onto my shoulders to take the message of him the message of his Redemption the message of his hope someplace that I'll never be able to take and just the fact that I was able to give you a KN to stand on to get you a little bit higher that's that's thanks enough yeah man yeah it's so good man I'm I'm so grateful let me let me ask you a question as we wrap up we talked a good bit about rejection right and I think that thinking about rejection and some of the struggle with it even either past struggles or current struggles man maybe just a parting word for those who are what are you telling yourself right and those moments where you begin to feel rejection when you begin to feel that inwardly and if you could tgraph yourself to one of those moments and prepare yourself to take the next steps to not allow it to compound and pull you down what does that look like for you Brian like how are you addressing that can you just maybe bring us into one of those moments of rejection and how you're dealing with it and I won't get into specific like a specific scenario but when that begins my what I first do is I take a deep breath I really because I get excited really fast and I get defensive really quickly because if defensiveness I believe and rejection go hand inand because I feel rejected so I'm going to be defensive and I'm going to be arrogant I'm going to be ugly and I'm going to cut you down to size and I'm going to get sarcastic and I'm going to get all that nastin so I need to take a breath step out of that scenario and really allow the Holy Spirit to dwell within me take a breath close my eyes and ask him to abide in me in that moment I breathe them in and allow him to be my peace it's it's almost like smoking like you get away and you light your cigarette you take a deep breath there's there's exercises there's physical exercises for me I get away I take a breath and I breathe in Holy Spirit and it's it's just that relaxing and say F first and foremost I ask if there's any truth of what's Happening because the enemy likes to disguise himself so am I feeling rejection because am I getting rejected or is it just a familiar Spirit type thing saying what I'm just G to mess with you today so is this true and if it is true and if someone is rejecting me it's it's he allows me to focus or I focus on his love his acceptance the word says that not to worry about the person that's going to be able to kill the body but the one that can give life to the soul re really is what he's saying is yes they can cut me down to size but God is has saved my soul he's renewed my spirit he made me alive he is my Lord and He Is My Savior he's the creator of everything he is outside of time and he loves me and that to me is enough because that's truth I am enough to him so once I begin to get my focus off of the rejection or the scenario and then I turn my eyes to him and I Magnify Him not only in my spirit but Al also in my eyes I my vision he magnifies he's bigger he becomes bigger like literally he's bigger than that rejection so that's where my focus is that's that's to me magnification is a huge thing I Magnify Him in the scenario so that bad scenario is smaller than he is so that's where my focus turns and that's where I become Then I can begin to start thinking more clearly and then I'm I'm a little bit more that's such good advice and like I was telling on was talking to my buddy my co-host about this last week we were talking about how even just the concept of like ministering to families and in the middle of the crisis and everything going on and some of that rejection happening with them and their loved one like our job is to slow the crisis down right and it's that phrase right there the context is a little different from internal rejection but that phrase it's like you've built a discipline to slow the crisis down right to slow it down and start to see it correctly and see it for what it is and yeah man that is very powerful I appreciate that well Brian I U man I'm grateful for the time today and U chatting I know we probably could talk for another hour or two couple more Yeah couple more I got two students waiting to enroll in the program right now man so we are very grateful for that and but is there any way that people can connect with you if they want to or do you have anything out there that I really don't I'm on Facebook just find me on Facebook what I look like mat match name to the face and that'll be me I appreciate it man and I will that book you mentioned earlier I will put the link for those who are interested in checking that out life changing brother life changing yeah man I'm excited to check that one out I don't think I've ever read that so well thanks man let