The Moment Curtis Knew God Wasn’t Done With Him

when stresses of life would come it was always drugs I would pick up some type of substance I went to the Heights The Depths I tried to outrun God or tried to think like there's got to be a different way to do this I don't know or my way I made my bed in hell multiple times and it was just this point of realizing like no matter where I go you continue to love me you continue to pursue me you continue to tell me like I'm qualified you he's continued to tell me like I've chosen you I've called you I think it was coming to that realization that he who started this work was going to finish it hey thank you so much for joining in to the transformed by hope podcast my name is Justin Fran and we're excited to have you here today as we just dive into stories right we really just want to be about bringing the hope of Jesus to people that are struggling with addiction and U man I got a few friends here with me today Rob how are you brother I'm always good man every day is good with Jesus bro yeah amen so welcome so where are we at today so we're in the Outpatient Center that we're opening here in Cumberland Maryland for the Team Cumberland Maryland for the Teen Challenge we're working on here getting ready to open next month nice that's awesome man praise God congratulations and we got somebody else with us so you want to introduce yeah this is my good friend I don't been a couple years now that I met Curtis palaski he he works for City reach here in Cumberland which is another faith-based discipleship program and one thing I love about them and his pastor and the leader there Fred is that they're always willing to jump in it's not about City reach or Teen Challenge it's about Jesus and reaching people for the lost and so we made a connection back then if have been friends ever since man he's a worship leader and man a lover of Jesus and a lover of reaching people for Jesus and so we're just glad to have Curtis here man are you going to sing for us today no okay I'm definitely not going to sing any worship here but oh man but I am surprised I guess to be here I didn't Rob told me I was going to come and just have a discussion and it would be a podcast but I'm just always privileged to encounter something new like this yeah and to really yeah the heart of hearts is to get the the hope of Jesus out there to people especially people that are broken and lost and especially nowadays the church itself is in dire need of God's love again and to reconnect and be intimate with him so that we can continue to do the work to reach out and save and get those people saved that are in the highways and byways amen so that's that's awesome and so tell us a little bit man about like how you got involved right cuz I know for myself and I can't imagine I've heard Rob share this before like 20 years ago recovery ministry right wasn't on the life plan I know for me it wasn't I can't speak for you but how did you get involved in recovery Ministry City reach what you're doing these days really I think we'd have to start at the beginning man of my first introduction to recovery wasn't faith-based faith-based faith-based I was I grew up in a dysfunctional family abuse a verbal physical abuse I got into drugs at 14 I went to rehab my senior year in high school for the first time I was wasn't graduating school I was failing out and while I was in there I met a lady who was trying to connect with the program I was in and she said oh you have a Bible I didn't grow up churched I didn't know anything about God to me Jesus was a relic that hung on a cross and had no personal relationship with God my dad had some history of being Catholic but he would just pray to himself it was a very a very kept to himself type of faith and I'm in this re have and I run into this lady she's like oh you have a Bible I'll pray for you the kid she was with was didn't want to be there so she left and I and know that was about it I got out I got back in I got graduated the program I got out and got back involved into drugs back then it was just drinking and marijuana and I came home from that trip and saw this lady again at a restaurant and I'm giving you my introduction into faith and then I'll speed it up for the sake of time I ran into this lady again she's like I've been praying for you God has a plan for your life and I'm like yeah you're weird I don't know who you are I don't maybe you like young guys I don't know cuz I was a 19-year-old guy yeah this was an older lady she was probably yeah 30s I don't know mid-30s and 30s is ancient when you're 19 huh now that we in our 30s like oh I'm not that old I'm 46 now so and I said well I'll take your number I had no intentions on calling her which I didn't and then two weeks later I start after care plan and this is all NAA drug counseling I go into St Francis Hospital and someone's running up a side street screaming my name and it's this lady again and she says Curtis you never called me I said yeah I know and I was pretty skeptic at that she said I've been praying for you this is God I'm telling you I've been praying that I'd run into you again he has a plan for your life he can change your life I said all right I'll take your number I did call her probably the next 2 3 months she would come over my parents house every Sunday and I would lock my bedroom door and be like you're crazy leave me alone I'd be cussing this woman up one side down the other afro out to hear Grateful Dead I was just a hippie I missed Woodstock but I still wanted to be a hippie can't see you the a it all right I had yeah I got pictures to prove it seen it and finally AUST wait I just missed something there what did you say he had an afro out there and I was like I can't picture him with an afro yeah sorry so finally August 17th 1997 I go to church with Lisa habira Assemblies of God Church in Pittsburgh and I just had an encounter with the presence of God I didn't know what I was experiencing I knew something was overwhelming me and this pastor saying the same thing this woman was saying to me God has a plan for you God can change your life and he said if you feel God tugging on your heart it's he wants you to respond to me it literally felt like something was pulling my heart and I he said I'm going to lead you into prayer there's no power in this prayer but the power is in you confessing and believing and as I was saying this prayer at 19 it felt like somebody was filling me up with warm water it's the only way could ever explain it from my feet and then when it hit the tip of my head I just uncontrollably broke I'm just weeping I'm talking snot coming out of my nose I was just broken undone and I began to get to discipled in the youth group I began to go to church there regularly I did two years of a program called Master's commission and went off to school to Foreigner School of ministry in Kansas City which is IHOP the International House of Prayer with Mike ble I spent about a year and a half there after that I I did online college through Global University yeah for to get credentialed I got married while I was in Kansas City had our first first and only child adala she's 18 today and my story is a struggle though I I got saved did God did radical things in my life but it's I had three major times in my life I fell back into addiction even as a Believer and following Christ and I faced many trials and tests and in 2016 is really where I got introduced to faith-based I was in and out of probably 10 or 12 different rehabs outpatient inpatient even as a Believer going to church getting surrendering and getting plugged in again and then eventually falling off I had strongholds I know I had in my life one of them was the fear of man another one was identity just false identity just condemning unworthy have no selfworth in 2016 2015 I was eventually my drug addiction turned into pills opiates and then heroin and as you're struggling with addiction like that you're not really going to church much anymore I'm just living life paying bills trying to hold things together and I feel a lot like Peter in some ways there were three times I just turned my back I didn't really rebel against God and stop believing but I just turned my back on following after him and pursuing him in 2016 is when I went back into I actually went into a Pittsburgh City reach hope home which rob briefly said I'm part of City reach church here in Cumberland Maryland and we have hope homes one for men and one for women and back then City reach was a bigger network with 100 plus different churches 20 some different hope homes all over the country and I went into the Pittsburgh City Rich hope home in 2016 my wife my ex-wife had left me she was done with the addiction and the heroin she took her daughter and left and that's a testimony I'll share coming up here about God restoring my relationship with my daughter amen and in 2016 I went into the men's hope Home Pittsburg for with City reach and finally I was ready to just lay it all down once again really take a longer term step towards recovery towards just saying God I don't want to I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired I know you love me the issue has never been with God it's been with me and I still have things I got to figure out and I was in there for seven months and God was radically working and moving in my life speaking to me I have journals just there there was moments he was just speaking to me every day reminding me of his promises reminding me of the call on my life reminding me of who Christ was and who I am in him and after 7even months of being there the founder of City reach and David Smith who's from Cumberland Maryland here and Fred timbrook they came to Wexford PA and had a meeting with me I didn't know I was having this meeting the director of the program back then said hey some people want to meet with you and I God had already been speaking to me I was always ran from the call of God in my life the responsibility the cuz there's a weight to it there's a burden you have to and and I wasn't I didn't really rely and give myself and make myself available to the Holy Spirit back then going ask you a question there real quick so you said you always ran from the call of God but yet I'm hearing early on in your story on Forerunner School of ministry right the school of ministry out there and Master's commission which are all like Ministry training schools like so help me understand that a little bit more right because there's that that dichotomy there between the two right there's the Str struggling with this call of God but also being trained and equipped for it at the same time so what was going on there it was really is those moments were me answering the call and laying my life down and then when life would come marriage pregnancy we lost our first pregnancy my ex-wife and I don't know when stresses of life would come I would succumb to them stresses okay and and I would start to compromise and I knew like I can't answer this calling when I'm still living in compromise like this it was always drugs I would pick up some type of substance I'd start go out for a drink here and there start smoking marijuana again and that would just jar and put a hindrance in me pursuing and then I'd be on a detour yeah so what was different right this the second time around like as you're you're getting ready I so I can imagine where the story's going right from here for the meeting up there and just putting it together but like what was different at that point what I'm saying and you like that you were I guess ready to surrender what I'm saying at that point and like God I'm I'm I'm taking this leap I'll be honest with you it's you I think David talks about this in the Psalms I went to the Heights The Depths I don't know I tried to outrun God or tried to think like there's got to be a different way to do this I don't know or my way I made my bed in hell multiple times and it was just this point of realizing like no matter where I go you continue to love me you continue to pursue me you continue to tell me like I'm qualified you he's continued to tell me like I've I've chosen you I've I've called you and I think it was coming to that realization that he who started this work was going to finish it and I yeah there's a burden there but it wasn't mine to carry myself right that's and I think I really began to realize like this is this is bigger than me and I can trust God to help me walk this out and it took a lot of I don't know the Stress and Anxiety off of me trying to work this out and letting him work it out through me when I heard you say something earlier so paning back a second but you said one of the issues that you dealt with was pleasing man so that probably played right into the fear and anxiety of if I take this on there then I got to make sure I do it right to please all these men to be able to do what God's called me to do so that probably just ped on top each other and that and there wasn't you had me I don't know if you mentioned we talking prior there wasn't faith-based recovery stuff like there is today and when I would struggle with addiction again or whatever I felt like I had no one I could relate to yeah like their biggest struggle was they forgot to read the Bible that week or something like that and I did I felt isolated it was hard for me to trust I kept a lot of people with arms length in Ministry CU ever since I got saved I've been involved in the church with Ministry seeing The Good the Bad and everything and everything I've been involved in has been good it's developed me but I think it was I think it was that just trying to find that place where I was I knew God accepted me and love me and I was okay being me in the midst of these things being worked out in me yeah but when I came to City reach it was like I don't know it's like you're finding your tribe in a sense yeah amen yeah there's just like Miss conception and I think a lot of times that like our journey to wholeness and purpose and the thing God calls us to it's rarely ever a straight path right there's it's crooked and he makes the Crooked Place straight I guess but like man there's just this there's this journey these ups and downs highs and lows that we all walk through and a lot of times I think especially in some of the circles that I run in it's like there's this Holy Ghost moment at the altar snot dripping all that which is wonderful like the God shows up like that but like that isn't all of the work yeah right it's just the beginning of the work and it's like the Altra call worked for you yes but like they people say all the time you works if you work it or whatever is that AA or is that Richard Simmons I don't know one of the two yeah but what I'm saying like we got to put work in after the Altra call like there are still things like the spirit of the Lord is there but like so are we I think I heard you say that like it wasn't God there wasn't an issue with God he's always been constant yeah the issue was starting to deal with me on the inside and I would love to go into a little bit more of that inner work that you be began to do in that process because especially for those in recovery they have these M up setbacks what I'm saying and it's like oh this all sucks I just it didn't work anyways and it's like but this refining process is a part of becoming Sanctified it's becoming who were called to be in Christ and what did that inner work look like in you like it's funny mention that cuz on the way over here I'm thinking like Lord I need a verse or something like that to sum up and but this the verse that there's many life verses that I have but James 1 chapter James chapter 1 verses 2 to 4 I'm sorry is consider pure joy when You Face Trials of many kinds for the testing of your faith develops perseverance and perseverance must finish its work so that you're whole and complete and lacking nothing and I've learned that a lot of these verses are for the what's yet to come even for Jesus returning and ET but they're also for the here and now and for anyone that would listen to this man it's a battle it's a fight to keep getting up and I always I thank the Holy Spirit that's in me for constantly saying like Curtis get up keep fighting keep pressing on you haven't arrived yet like there's more for this embrace learn I remember God gave me that verse early on as a Christian and I was like this isn't encouraging at all I do us and along with the one that where Jesus says to Simon Simon Satan is asked to sift you like wheat come on I'm yeah and I'm like yeah none of that sounds encouraging but I I've learned to embrace the trials and the setbacks and the challenges because they've developed me like you said refined me and strengthened me in Christ and have just really just solidified who he is as our savior who he is as our faithful Shepherd he will never leave us nor forsake us he like I shared in the beginning he started this he's going to finish it yeah and he's in me yeah and there's nothing I can do I was looking up another verse here Romans 8:38 to 39 there's there's there's nothing I have become convinced like Paul has nothing can separate me from his love yeah and it's just getting to it's I've gotten to a place really in The Last 5 Years where I feel like I've really matured in my faith and really started to own and take ownership of my calling my identity in Christ the offices that the office he's given me the gifts he's given me and the realization is that nothing can separate me from that I can't I'm not that powerful to mess up something the creator of the universe has started that's really but everything is built yeah every trial and test has built me up to be where I sit today is the wholest and fullest and most complete I've ever been in my life and I'm continuing to break ground and move into greater things not just my personal life but discipling other men in Our Hope homes being a prophetic voice to our church I believe even to this community and just God just building upon that so it's yeah it's so good A lot of people out there and I think your testimonies talking about I'm glad you went through that part of it because you've been in church and then still fell out and still fell out even after to the encounters and Justin said it like the encounter can do it but sustaining the relationship to sustain the beginning it's like meeting a girl when you first fall in love that's great but it has to grow from there into something deeper and one of the things I love about him is he's a lover of the secret place like I am like in what you're describing those trials and temptations like every time that we go through that to be made in the image of Christ to be formed and shaped and molded into him obviously all of us have stuff we got to get out because we don't look like him none of us have Paul said I haven't arrived yet we haven't either but his process to get there to fight the good fight of Faith to believe even in the trial that he's good to believe in even in situations of bad reports from doctors or family not being there and relationships not working these are the things that always run us back to drugs and alcohol that's the hard part it's like hold on the way that I look at this though our perspective as Paul was talking about to consider or James pure joy the way we look at a trial being able to say hey what I know and this is something I've had to learn over the past 14 years the hard way most of times but to know that whatever I'm facing right now the enemy is going to overplay his hand and it's going to draw me with the right perspective closer to Jesus make me more like him help me love people the way he loves if I just see it the way that James said it in that verse I love that verse because it's like if I consider it Joy when I go through this and then because I go through it having its work working its fullness like patience and perseverance has to you have to go through that endure that then it can get you to maturity like it's the only way to get to maturity we don't want to hear that we don't want to hear the cost of that and what it goes to but the reason why we can do that is he's tapped into it too it's this secret place man and I think that a lot of people in church never even understand that there is a such thing what and so I don't know if you want to share a little bit on your thought on the secret place man and what because I know you're a worshipper and I know where it comes from and I know that's my heart of hearts obviously Jesus is the ultimate example he was he came in the flesh as a man but David David was a man like I'm a man and he's probably one I relate to the most in scripture and in Psalm 27 he talks about this one thing I ask this one thing I desire to dwell in your house to hear your voice to inquire in your temple to just to behold the one who am I that you're mindful of me who am I that you love me like this who am I that you pursue me who am I that you make a place for you and me to dwell together and commune and that's probably the thing that's been solidified in my life is he's made that place for us with him and nothing can separate us from that's so good there's no sin there's no demon there's no backsliding there's no mistake I can make there's no problem I have there's no stronghold that's that's hard enough to break there's no chain there's nothing and he's just like he's worn down any excuse I could possibly have or any idea to think that like there's there's anything that's going to that's that's going to stop or hinder that and one of my prayers has always been Lord I really want to live a life I want to live a life that is that exemplifies and lives out a life of what you died and rose again for and it is in that secret place where we encounter that love we tap into his holy spirit like that and the realization like you were touching on that he works all things together like it's an he's an Unstoppable Force what and if he's called us to do something it's going to happen yeah I don't know you can go kicking or Screaming or you can just allow it to most of us me usually do yeah but there's that place it's it'd be a shame one of the guys in the home says this now Jesus tore the veil yeah to give us pure unadulterated communion with the creator of the universe and it's a shame when we don't access that yeah and we don't realize that God wants to meet with us and encounter us on a regular basis not just at an altar when I got saved or moments throughout my life and then that's what keeps us filled and keeps us focused I believe that's something I've been really owned in the last five years like God I want to I asked God again I said I want to fall in love with you like I did when I first met you I want to go back to my first love just where it was just P I was just radically in love with you I didn't worry about studying scripture I didn't worry about these religious traditions and these steps to take or who to please or positions or any of that I just want to be in love with you again and he brought me back to that place and it's just grown if you want to call it the secret place yeah whatever you want to call it lone time secret abiding if anyone knows me well enough they're like yeah Curtis who use the word abide yeah come on I was as you were talking I was thinking about Bon hofer's book The cost of discipleship if you guys have ever read that D Bon Hoffer's powerful book it's just a quote here that hit my thoughts when y'all were talking it says cheap Grace is Grace without discipleship Grace without the cross Grace without Jesus Christ Living in incarnate costly Grace however is the treasure hidden in the field for the sake of it man will go and sell all that he has it's the Pearl a great price to buy which the merchant will sell all of his Goods it's the kingly rule of Christ for say man will pluck out the eye which causes him to stumble is the call of Jesus Christ at which the disciple leaves his Nets and follows him this is it right here costly Grace is the gospel which must be sought again and again the gift which must be asked for the door at which man must knock such Grace is costly because it calls us to follow and it is Grace because it calls us to follow Jesus Christ I love that quote that book by the way if you've never read it like it will yeah it will just make you rethink your entire life within the first three or four pages Bon Hofer was like in Nazi Germany and wrote this book he was a missionary over there and like he goes through this whole book is powerful but as you were talking about that whole idea salt again and again right like every time there's a stumble every time there's a slip up like I'm not trying to earn my position with him but like it's easy if the Lord asked me to give up a car like can give it off stuff what I'm saying it's much harder to give away pieces of me yeah like I more gladly give my stuff away but like I want to hold on to my sin and my mess my shame all that stuff because I feel like it's a part of me what I'm saying and that's that part of like dying to self like without the holy spirit's help of like surrendering that stuff to the cross over and over again but yet because it's so ingrained a lot of times in who we are it keeps popping back up and it's like no I have to pursue this good news right that he came to die to cover those sins again and there's no price too great to pay and that's you're uncovering that with the secret place like right it's paying that price it's being willing to go right back to the Master's feet and not because he like not because we have to earn it because it's a love Rel like I know who I am when I'm in his presence yeah and there's just so much joy to be found in those moments so man it's so good sorry so fin the story so finish the story you're in Pittsburgh right and yeah Fred sorry yeah that was seven months I'm I'm in the city reach men's hope home in Pittsburgh and God had been speaking to me like there's there one of the moments again like Curtis I'm I'm about to shift and change everything in your life again and he's given me that Faith like all right Lord let's do this let's step out and I come and have they came to Pittsburgh Fred and David Smith and had a meeting with them and Brian bolt and Brian said just share your testimony and share what God's been doing in the last seven months of your life in the men's hope home and I just began to share and the Pres presence of God just filled the room I'm crying and they're crying like it was just a moment and then the next day I'm at devotions cuz in the home we do devotions and bible study every morning John Stucker was the director of the men's home back then he calls me out and says hey pack your bags you're going to you're going to Cumberland you're going to be their next home director and that was going into 2017 to 2019 I directed the city reach men's home hope home back then and I've always been involved in worship and singing playing a guitar and God's developed that gift in me as well so I directed The home for 2 years and you talk about discipleship being in a faith-based CU I live in the home with the men it's raw discipleship it's real deal yeah you're dealing with you're dealing with real stuff real emotions real psychological stuff real real strongholds that these guys battle and face and and to be able to have God walked me through all these things in my own life there is no better therapy really there is no better solution than having somebody who's been through that yeah been through that on that Battlefield and have come out the other side Victorious there's so much Brilliance in Jesus's words like follow me and I will make you Fishers of Men yeah like you just think about that and just even what you just said right like the work that happens in us the things that we learn about who we are when we decide to go fishing right when we you're out there you're baiting the hook or whatever the line's getting all tangled up in the process and I'm a terrible fisherman like I grew up in a country family we always did the camping trips and all that and I was just the guy who just couldn't get the fishing skills down and I wouldn't take care of my pole put it away correctly so then I'd go to pull it out the line would be all tangled what I'm saying but it's just that process of like the Brilliance of Jesus like calling us into the work of the Kingdom as well cuz we discover a lot about who we are when we're trying to help call other people higher and if we're and I think there's some self-reflection there right because most of us aren't just most people in Ministry there are few that we see on the news and the TV and all of that are just outright in it for the wrong reasons but most of the Ministers of the Gospel in the country like are also trying to be refined as they're helping to refine other people like that's the narrative the not narrative isn't the celebrity mega church pastor who fell who had pure impure motives the whole way the narrative is guys like yourself who are like pursuing the call of Jesus helping people be discipled but also realizing that I'm still being transformed as well I'm fishing and God's refining me I I share that with quite often with the men in the home that even though I'm I'm I'm a director and God has given me a position that I am still there is no high tower where we finally get to this place where we're up here and everyone's trying to get there Jesus came down into the square he went into the red light district he was a part of man yeah and I always share that with the men like listen I'm right where you're at you I might be a little further down the road so to speak to say hey come on you this you can get here and I'll come back and try to help guide you along but I'm in no POS position higher than them or I'm still in this fight I always say I'm still in the program I'm just not in the program anymore but it's a lifelong there are days I wish I was it's so nice not having to make decisions what I'm saying I'm sorry I just SP all over but like so we were talking offline a little bit though about the Dynamics you were just talking about the rawness of discipleship and Recovery Ministries right and what you're doing living in the house in the trenches and then like the ju position of that from church ministry right typical Sunday what I'm saying and how sometimes when it's just like a hour a week hour and a half or whatever what I'm saying in typical Bible studies and not that there's anything wrong with that but it's not as raw and messy and in your face as living with somebody 24 hours a day seven days a week and so like but you serve in both y all have Ministries that you have a church right and then you also have a discipleship home and I know you told me Offline that like y'all have always been going after the broken and whatnot but I guess as a follower and a leader how do you reconcile some of those differences and what we see as messy discipleship and I'm going to get to the question just a second I'm sorry but I always told somebody a long time ago programs like City reach Freedom House Teen Challenge like they really are a incredible picture of the early Church yeah we live together we eat together we work together we make sure everybody's needs are taken care of what I'm saying we worship together all of it and yet typical Sunday morning church is just we just worship together and maybe have a pot lock together every once in a while right and so I guess that discipleship process man like is like let me ask you I'm not going to ask you to solve all the church's problems right but like yeah how do you see that differing like what I'm saying and how does the church get to that spot where discipleship is maybe a little more raw messy and authentic like we know it to be in recovery Ministries yeah it's a there is a line there it's and I don't know we I guess we've crossed it because discipleship is living life and doing life together through the struggles through the pains through the hardships and living reality like I shared my life the reality of tests and trials there's going to be setbacks there's going to be Hang-Ups there's going to be things even guys that complete a 9month to a year program they don't have it all together and I don't the reality is just none of us will ever have it all together Brennan Manning is a pastor and author and I've read a couple of his books the ragamu and gospel but he talks about the reality of like a man will never be where he should be we're always continuing to need the grace of God and the love but and it's it's understanding that I believe even as Christians that don't so-called have life-controlling issues or something like that they're just as in need of discipleship and the grace of God and growing in maturity being equipped as someone that just it's it's evident that they're broken into pieces and they need to put back together the reality is if we all recognize the depths of our separation from God and sin and what it's really has done to us as humans that we're all just as broken and H having a body of Christ to realize that yeah that no one is in a no one's in this place that that they don't need that discipleship yeah it's like the only difference between us and them if you will is that the evidence of my sin shows up on my arm is need a marks yeah and if everybody's what I'm saying if everybody else is sin would show up like track marks like could you imagine the I guess the push or the eagerness for more discipleship if it was that evident but a lot of times it's the secret and hidden sin right the stuff that we it's not an issue that we struggle it's an issue that we refuse to acknowledge and struggle amen and that tends to be the biggest issue I think you seem like you're chomping the B to say something there Rob go ahead man go ahead never well it just goes back to one of my favorite scriptures first John I think it's one or two where verses 1 through six it's like he's pure light in him there's no darkness and when we remain in unbroken Fellowship that's when the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all in righteousness so for people to realize no matter what that is whether it's the track marks or whether it's gossip or whe whatever but some of the problems I've noticed over the years that makes it hard for people is everybody the way people look at the altar and people when they come and being able to bring things to the light in the church setting I think as a whole maybe it's it's been made difficult for people to come forth and say hey I'm struggling with pornography or hey I'm struggling with this it might not show up and y'all might think I'm fine and so if we could work at and I know we all do it but like somehow work at making it a safe place yeah to be able to do that I think we would find discipleship a little easier but you said it's like being able to admit it and put it out there and that's what it is it's like putting it in the light and so unfortunately that keeps us from the secret place because we learn that we hide it instead of put it out there but when we learn to put it out there we can go boldly to the secret place and we know what he does when we're there like it's not an issue we're white clean we're all of it's taken out and but it how do I guess the question would be maybe it's a question for you I don't know like how can we you Pastor a church too how can we make the atmosphere at our church at our altars a safe place to come into the light with whatever issue you got yeah I try to model it so I think there's there's a line right as a leader like and like not all my personal business needs to be public and there's there's wisdom and discernment in that but like also a couple months ago man I was just I was having a rough couple weeks we were dealing with a lot of stuff at home I called somebody up like I was really going through it and I just was not in the frame of mind to preach and I'm like man I am I'm in a spot right now where my emotions are going to show up in my message and rather than help heal people there's a potential in my words could hurt them because I am in a raw spot right now I called one of the guys in the church and I said I listen this last minute I usually don't drop this on people but I need you to cover for me and he got up covered for me and the very next week I got up in front of the church and said thank you I was having a terrible week I was not in the frame of mind to get up here and talk to you guys and was just honest about it like and I didn't try to overp spiritualize it right and once that vulnerability came out yeah the body of Christ was able to do what it does best and surround us so many of us never experienced that body of the Christ because we're too busy hiding it we've got the fear of man going on like we all struggle with the insecurity the identity issues so we don't want anybody to think that there's anything wrong you're the pastor and nobody can help us yeah like that's the problem like your arm's not broken why am I going to post splint on it what I'm saying like there's no need for a cast but like man it's just it's beautiful I wasn't planning on going there but thanks Rob I hate you so Curtis man tell me tell me a little bit about your journey now you work with them in at City reach and now what is God doing in your ministry in your life right now like just present day maybe there's a story that resonates with you or something that's just burning inside of you at the moment honestly what you were just talking about the the church coming together and being equipped to to be the church that it doesn't fall you I there's a I tell the men in my home like we're all in this together we're all have to support each other you all have a position in a sense a position and a place in all this to serve and to support each other and I really think in Ministry where I'm at right now even within our church that's what's beginning to happen is that awareness that it's it's not just on the pastor's short ERS or on but we're all coming together to be equipped and to be raised up to play our part as the body and to fun because it's going to manifest the Fuller presence of who Jesus is when every body part plays its part recognizing that Jesus is the head and being real I know for me like the relationships I have with my senior pastor and associate pastor they're not business relationships they're they're not they're we're brothers we're friends I'm able to be real I'm able to have moments where I'm like listen I just feel like quitting man yeah I'm like tapped out and I'm able to I'm I'm just this is just the season I'm in my life is being completely transparent and real and it's not sin yeah and if we look at it we sometimes we can look at things like oh man this is sin or I'm not willing to serve it I'm just being real about walking out and carrying your cross and following after God and trying to lead other people that same way but that's something dynamically that's the dynamic of that has changed my life to be open to Paul says boast in our weaknesses really like put them like a billboard on the side of the highway like hey you don't have to tell me that I don't have it all together I already know what and it's not sin it's not like you're struggling with stuff but I've I've learned if I can be honest and real like you're saying and transparent then I don't fall I won't fall into the things that are real struggles yeah or then it becomes sin and something I'm wrapping myself up in because I was afraid to just be real yeah that's right and I share that with I'm very transparent with the men I disciple as well so they can see like hey man this guy's not like I remember a lot of people discouraged me when I first started Freedom House in that they're like man you can't be like that transparent with them I don't care I tell them Financial stuff difference to me I'm like I'm not you can't find any ammunition to like throw at me because I'm giving it all to you yeah what and I did get a lot of people in G like you can't do that don't do that I'm like they need to see what because they need to not put none of us on a pedestal either need to see that hey we are going in the same direction we are doing that and as we follow Jesus like one of the parts we don't talk about enough I think Jesus did go to the garden and say hey father if there's any other way in his flesh he did do exactly what we're saying hey I'm at a point where I would really just like to quit if there's an easier way we churches don't want to talk about but he it's in the Bible I'm am I saying anything that's not Bible it is he's he's crying out God okay but yet your will what tested in all points as us yeah so it's like he even got and that's such an example God left them things in there for us cuz there is times off me and you had plenty of conversations over the years hey I'm ready to quit hey I don't know what to do hey pray for me hey I'm going to go fast hey I'm taking sabatical hey I'm doing mean that's one thing I've Loved about our relationship over I don't know like 10 years now like we've had that where we've just been like hey this is where I'm at this sucks right now yeah this sucks I just want to quit man will you please pray for me will you fast for me will you do this and then the one time I did he told you earlier like I called him hey want you come preach what it's just like God told me like I knew where he was at because we have that Honesty with each other and I think if leaders like you said if leaders could not only be that way in front of their congregation but man if we could keep around people ourselves in our Inner Circle that we can do that with you just said the magic thing if you can do it with those things you won't then keep going into the other things so how do you overcome though specifically thinking let me get closer to the mic thinking of even guys in recovery circles I don't like let me I'm going to say wounded by the church or wound let me wounded by church people cuz I don't like to say Church hurt or wounded by the church because that's too broad right wounded by certain people within the church that have had that vulnerability and that transparency used against them right or we like let's Beyond we work in recovery Ministry so there are moments when we do say things and then that's being repeated back with a spin on it in a different context what I'm saying and so how do y all how do you work through that like right this idea of vulnerability and transparency but staying tender and remaining there even when it's been like maybe turned against you or you've experienced hurt on the other side of being vulnerable and transparent yeah I've been I've had my own experience with being hurt by people because the real church is out there people that are genuinely going after God and genuinely Allowing God to work out the things that need worked out in their lives but I just I try for me personally I've had to focus on the only one that is my true source of love and fulfillment is Christ himself I had that fear of man and trying to please man and do those things and I think in a lot of ways I set myself up to be hurt because I'm looking to a fouble person that doesn't have it all together yeah that might try to look like they got it all together and I'm I'm I'm putting them up on a pedestal really in a place of God and then I'd be let down or something would be handled the wrong way and it would get turned around and here I am like on the low end of the stick again because of a situation or because of a personal struggle or something like that and I think the solution to that really is establishing the right it's like healing our image of God and who he really is yeah and healing the real image of ourselves and how he sees us and realizing that if I'm approved by him and fully loved and fully accepted by him and I learn to trust him with everything in me like he is my source and realizing that also that men that aren't perfect if they're trusting him and he's their source as well I can trust the man across from me but I'm not going to look to them as my savior or look to them as like that's good they're going to make a mistake Rob is going to say something the wrong way that might hurt my feelings or something but but I'm also realizing that he is he's he's a human like I am listen the reality is I probably done the same thing 3 months back or I'll probably do it three months from now where I can come across but the heart of hearts as a true follow of Christ is you're not you're not trying to hurt people but sometimes sometimes it happens yeah in the midst of life it's good I heard on I don't remember if I heard this or what where it came from but like we're all transparent with God right honestly Nick it before him he sees everything right the difference is vulnerability right and so transparency is people seeing through the window right vulnerability is giving them the keys to the door and letting them come in the house yeah you can see through the window it's transparent or you going to see what's going on but vulnerability is when they come in you allow them the opportunity you get all ball up in your business like right it's me giving you the knife and trusting you to not cut me with it yeah and that is like that's the huge difference like if we're going to be vulnerable before God and before people then we're got to let them in the door right behold I stand at the door and knock and he wants to come in and get all up in our business rearrange our furniture I love CS Lewis's illustration of the house you guys heard that before where he's he comes in and you're wondering why he's tearing balls down he's like hey I'm not building a place for you to dwell I'm building a place for me to dwell and that we only get there through the vulnerability it's really good so Curtis man how can people connect with City reach if on somebody comes across clip catches this video here on YouTube and they need help they could go to our website at cityreach cumberland.com and information's on there about our hope homes they could fill out an intake form online they could also concerning the men's home they could reach me at 24522 8232 and we could do an over the phone assessment intake phone call we also have a women's home I don't have her information present right now to I don't have it to memory but the main way would be to look us up online okay most of our stuff is online right now through our website yeah we'll put everything in the we'll put everything in the comments ments below Rob did you have any other questions man no I don't think so or they could show up at church on Sunday at City reach right yeah Sunday at come suay come here Curtis W actually I have a guy the next two weeks I won't be on the worship team I have a guy graduating graduating this coming Sunday so I have to just be focused on that and walking him through that the ceremony if you want to call it that and then T the Sunday after that I'm actually preaching so oh yeah it's be cool yeah oh I need to come aome do you guys live your services too we do Sunday mornings at live sweet I will put all the links down in the description for everybody watching I just want to ask you a a closing question and on this is fun when I do it at my studio CU I'm a huge Back to the Future fan okay so I have a Lego DeLorean that sits on my shelf behind me when I'm talking I didn't bring the DeLorean with me huh do you like Back to the Future one of my favorite movie trilogies we got to get back to the Future McFly so that's a good movie anyways if you could hop in DeLorean okay and travel back to when you're fresh out of the Bible programs right you're you're you've just explored this call to Ministry answered the call to Ministry and I don't ask the question would you change anything about the past cuz I don't think that's that's a useful question but what would Curtis today tell Curtis from back then there fresh out of the fora School of ministry or Master's commission getting ready to take this next phase of life knowing all that now all the experience the stuff that you've walked through the work that the Lord's done in your life what would you tell ctis back then H interesting question it is glad you didn't me [Music] [Music] [Music] to I had one guy tell me that he would tell him to watch his diet said he said eat healthier said Fair answer but yeah I think I would tell myself back then Curtis just keep keep trus in God and know that he's got it all worked out you're going to struggle you're going to have a lot of I don't know what to do m moment you're going to have moments where you feel like you've just forfeited it all you're going to have victories you're going to have good things happen in life and through it all just keep trusting and knowing that God's got it all laid out and you're going to hit the mark As long as you continue to trust him and know that he loves you yeah and just continue to believe yeah that's good yeah I heard somebody asked that p a question to a guest on a podcast one time and I have hijacked the question ever since un ashamedly stealing like an artist Bing like an artist whatever they call it so man I appreciate it well Curtis I appreciate you jumping on man and getting to know each other a little bit and sharing your story and being open and vulnerable right and transparent cuz that's what we've been talking about the whole time and man it's good it's just refreshing I always love connecting with people that have stories have been through some things and but also have just a heart to know God but also see other people that were in our same mess on no God I find there's two like there usually is two types of recovery folks there are those who it's just a part of their past they don't want to it's it's something I did back then and that's okay like they don't but then there are the others of us that just send to talk about it like all the time and like it is a huge part of our story and I've really respect the guys that continue to pursue purpose and try to rescue other people from in the pit amen it's a awesome thing amen so well thank you all for watching on trans thank you all for watching transformed by hope again all of the links for City reach the church social media All That Jazz The Hope homes all of that will be in the description below this is your first time here please hit the like button subscribe to the channel and again share some of this content the more that you share the more that you put it in the hands of other people we can continue to do the work of putting hope with in reach of everyone struggling with addiction hey God bless you and thanks for watching